Moderation Suggestion <3

[BlackWolf]

Well if I follow intesively some thread where posts are spammed with decent enought rate.. lets say for example in alliance discussions section... and suddenly amount of posts changes and theres 17 posts missing... even not even one of those is mine. I always get WTF I am so sure there was so much more posts... how come this thread is only 5 pages long anymore even I was sure it was on 7th page earlier.

So yes I very much apreciate if people (read mods) use the brains to realize that when "silently" is not silent no matter what you do and to make things easier for people you should just instead drop that message there. And ask people to stick to topic / no flaming etc from there on.

I dont think when Azzer has asked for "silent" moderating he meant not to use brains at all.

 

[pinpower]

I am all for some sort of notification system. But BW, if none of the posts were yours and you saw that some had been removed...why does it actually matter to you? Its obvious that they have been removed for a reason so that should be enough...

And 17 posts in one thread is rare, its normally the odd post here and there. Not enough to be that obvious to other users (than the poster themselves).

Like i said, im all for some sort of system being put in place...but i dont see why other forum users (other than the poster themselves) would be that concerned.

 

[Azzer]

Regarding mods posting notifications about edits or removals or otherwise "Publically" on a thread;

If you could see how many posts get edited for a bit of swearing, mild flaming, trolling... and how many get moderated for being rubbish topic and soul destroying spam... you'd realise that a post by mods on every single thread where they did any edits or removals would basically mean the forums were full of threads where randomly interjected through the thread, regular and more casual forum users would see a nice consistant thread (because it's already been modded) and suddenly see loads of posts by mods saying things like;

"This thread was modded. Please keep on topic " or "I edited some flames, please keep it clean "

Which would just look like the forums were full of psychotic nazi moderators who were obsessed with showing to every single person that ever looks at the thread anytime in the future that they were there, and they did something.

It's why I support silent editing - as in - NOT "advertising" the fact that these mods are editing everything and reminding everybody that ever looks at a thread (including the hundreds of casual viewers and lurkers that would never have seen the bad content that got modded) that they were there, editing.

I've already said however that if we can find a way of auto PM'ing people that have posts modded - so it doesn't "advertise" that fact forevermore to everyone that views a thread - then great. But I disagree entirely with posting on a thread that gets modded, and anyone that suggests so either has no idea how many posts get minor edits or removals or hasn't thought how things might look to outside observers if mods posted such "notices" everywhere

 

[BlackWolf]

Regarding mods posting notifications about edits or removals or otherwise "Publically" on a thread;

If you could see how many posts get edited for a bit of swearing, mild flaming, trolling... and how many get moderated for being rubbish topic and soul destroying spam... you'd realise that a post by mods on every single thread where they did any edits or removals would basically mean the forums were full of threads where randomly interjected through the thread, regular and more casual forum users would see a nice consistant thread (because it's already been modded) and suddenly see loads of posts by mods saying things like;

"This thread was modded. Please keep on topic " or "I edited some flames, please keep it clean "

Which would just look like the forums were full of psychotic nazi moderators who were obsessed with showing to every single person that ever looks at the thread anytime in the future that they were there, and they did something.

It's why I support silent editing - as in - NOT "advertising" the fact that these mods are editing everything and reminding everybody that ever looks at a thread (including the hundreds of casual viewers and lurkers that would never have seen the bad content that got modded) that they were there, editing.

I've already said however that if we can find a way of auto PM'ing people that have posts modded - so it doesn't "advertise" that fact forevermore to everyone that views a thread - then great. But I disagree entirely with posting on a thread that gets modded, and anyone that suggests so either has no idea how many posts get minor edits or removals or hasn't thought how things might look to outside observers if mods posted such "notices" everywhere

I think theres "small" difference between editing some swearwords or deleting one post cause of bittering than deleting 17! posts from thread. But what ever rocks your boat.

 

[pinpower]

I think people need to not get so caught up on the 17 post thing...that VERY rarely happens. Usually its the odd 1/2 posts in a thread.

 

[willymchilybily]

Why the hell this needs to be posted to suggestions? This should be automatical thing. Everything from common sense to logic says it is normal way to work if you touch someone elses property you notify that person of it.

Seeing this kind of thing posted in suggestions and the need to do so sums up exactly what is wrong with these forums and this game.

what a chirpy fella, and i agree with the suggestion

 

[harriergirl]

Once again I've had a post removed with no note as to why or who moved it.

Azzer, seriously, Is a note really that much extra work that your admins can't accomplish it ?

 

[Martin]

Once again I've had a post removed with no note as to why or who moved it.

Azzer, seriously, Is a note really that much extra work that your admins can't accomplish it ?

Tana....

Don't take this as malicious but I want to post as constructivly as possible, and am not one to flower my words:

1. WTF is your problem with staff members? We get reported posts with snobby messages about how we have let yet more topics get wildly out of control. Everything we do or not do you critisise us for, I know we (as a collective) don't do everything that people agree with but sheeeesh, give us a break!
2. You post spammy pictures in discussion threads and now want to argue about not being told it was deleted when it is blindingly obvious why... (note: It wasn't me but I did have a look to see your last post that was modded and agree with the unapproval 100%).


The matter in question is interesting, I unapprove one word posts when it is *obviously* spam and feel no need to message the user. I see no reason to entertain such posts and to justify to the user while I delete them. Any posts which there would be (IMO) any debate about why it was removed I PM the user and inform them. I even am nice enough to PM people to say I have removed 1-2 posts, you may wish to edit yours as it now doesn't correspond and flow in the thread.
I am not going to start sending PMs to people to say "Your thread was blatent spam as you just road 'tart' so I deleted it" as I'd send so many of them messages it would kill me.

I don't mind notifications along the lines of "So and so unapproved your post, and did not give a reason" IF they wanted to raise it with me I would happily answer.

I Mod with common sense, if people don't post with common sense then they are not worth constant pampering and entertaining over and over again for splurting out the same old crap.


To end, I would like to add I do not think I am a fantastic Mod, I am not over critical and would rather leave posts until they escalate than try and pre-empt issues, and am generally very lax about posts, as freedom of speach is needed and noone likes nazi Mods.

 

[harriergirl]

It's not about the mods themselves Martin, it never has been. With the exception of one or 2 of mods on the staff, I genuinely like and respect you all.

It is the principle behind the matter. There are ways things should be done, and frankly it's rude and lazy to not drop a note. Azzer should be reinforcing these ideas, but because there is no central controlling mind behind the staff ( yes Azzer but when it comes to people he's clueless and he knows it ), things are done consistantly insconsistantly, sometimes very poorly, and too often with little regard to the people who are using the forums as opposed to running them.

Each and everytime I have an example, It will be posted, until I am banned, deleted or stop caring.

Much Love
Tana

The matter in question is interesting, I unapprove one word posts when it is *obviously* spam and feel no need to message the user. I see no reason to entertain such posts and to justify to the user while I delete them. Any posts which there would be (IMO) any debate about why it was removed I PM the user and inform them. I even am nice enough to PM people to say I have removed 1-2 posts, you may wish to edit yours as it now doesn't correspond and flow in the thread.
I am not going to start sending PMs to people to say "Your thread was blatent spam as you just road 'tart' so I deleted it" as I'd send so many of them messages it would kill me.

I don't mind notifications along the lines of "So and so unapproved your post, and did not give a reason" IF they wanted to raise it with me I would happily answer.

I Mod with common sense, if people don't post with common sense then they are not worth constant pampering and entertaining over and over again for splurting out the same old crap.

If everyone were notified and punished according to the rules then I would wager the number of modifications needed each day would go down. There is a better way to do things, just because no one wants to try doesn't mean it's not true.

You act as though I dont' know what I'm talking about, but firstly, I have modded these boards, albeit for a short stint, and 2ndly I have had vast amounts of real world training on managing people , customer service, and appropriate discipline. It's like when alci sees bad grammar ... you just can't let it go.

 

[Martin]

It's not about the mods themselves Martin, it never has been. With the exception of one or 2 of mods on the staff, I genuinely like and respect you all.

It is the principle behind the matter. There are ways things should be done, and frankly it's rude and lazy to not drop a note. Azzer should be reinforcing these ideas, but because there is no central controlling mind behind the staff ( yes Azzer but when it comes to people he's clueless and he knows it ), things are done consistantly insconsistantly, sometimes very poorly, and too often with little regard to the people who are using the forums as opposed to running them.

Each and everytime I have an example, It will be posted, until I am banned, deleted or stop caring.

Much Love
Tana

Maybe so and I do agree it's laziness on my part, but I do look at some posts and it os obvious spam from a long time user so I just remove it. If I do something I normally drop the user a line (BW will vouch for that), just with the amount of obvious, spammy, pointless posts that get unapproved it would be too time consuming and it is not worth mine (speaking about me individually) to always PM a user about it.

I am a fan of an automated system that informs the user becasue I agree, it's curtesy for them to know one of their posts has been changed, but I *personally* am not going to entertain stupid posts and waste my time on obvious things.

The matter in question is interesting, I unapprove one word posts when it is *obviously* spam and feel no need to message the user. I see no reason to entertain such posts and to justify to the user while I delete them. Any posts which there would be (IMO) any debate about why it was removed I PM the user and inform them. I even am nice enough to PM people to say I have removed 1-2 posts, you may wish to edit yours as it now doesn't correspond and flow in the thread.
I am not going to start sending PMs to people to say "Your thread was blatent spam as you just road 'tart' so I deleted it" as I'd send so many of them messages it would kill me.

I don't mind notifications along the lines of "So and so unapproved your post, and did not give a reason" IF they wanted to raise it with me I would happily answer.

I Mod with common sense, if people don't post with common sense then they are not worth constant pampering and entertaining over and over again for splurting out the same old crap.

If everyone were notified and punished according to the rules then I would wager the number of modifications needed each day would go down. There is a better way to do things, just because no one wants to try doesn't mean it's not true.

You act as though I dont' know what I'm talking about, but firstly, I have modded these boards, albeit for a short stint, and 2ndly I have had vast amounts of real world training on managing people , customer service, and appropriate discipline. It's like when alci sees bad grammar ... you just can't let it go.

I don't understand refering to your first point, why would this go happen, because people realise nazi Mods are breathing down their necks all day, I wonder if we will get any complains and gripes about that....?

I do not mean to come accross as suggesting you you not knowing what you are talking about, and I do not want to come accross as *knowing* I am 100% right. I am merely debated a grey area with a skilled opponent.

 

[harriergirl]

ahah actually yes. exactly because people would realise and know ahead of time that thier posts are going to be removed and that there will be actual reprocussions for breaking the rules.

Everyone refers to nazi mods and complaints, and to a degree, you and others are right, there would be a kickback, alot of complaints about nazi mods, and stupid rules, but eventually those people would either learn or leave, while the rest of the boards would become open to those who are clearly hanging around, but yet never post. The pendulum would swing both ways and eventually come back to the middle but with a forums that is more user friendly, less hateful towards newcomers.

I said You when I was talking about my training, and I didn't mean You specifically although I see why it came out that way. I just mean You as in the big YOU of people who don't understand why I don't let these things go.

I'm all for the automated system, but it's not here yet.

 

[Martin]

To sumarise:

We both want an automated system because we agree that the collective we (or I before people pipe up about it) are lazy. We disagree it would have a guaranteed positive effect.

So we need a system in place which we all know, users and Mods where the boundaries are known. Be it automated or not and see how it does.

Therefore, I as a Mod, bat it back to Azzer to change how I operate if he sees fit.

 

[harriergirl]

To sumarise:

We both want an automated system because we agree that the collective we (or I before people pipe up about it) are lazy. We disagree it would have a guaranteed positive effect.

So we need a system in place which we all know, users and Mods where the boundaries are known. Be it automated or not and see how it does.

Therefore, I as a Mod, bat it back to Azzer to change how I operate if he sees fit.

except in the instances where i've brought up a specific mod's name or behavior, Please always assume that these suggestions and mentions are directed towards azzer. I for one know and understand that your job is hard, and in some instances it's made harder by rules that are constantly open for interpretation. I sincerely apologise if you or your counterparts felt offended.

 

[Azzer]

There is a mod available that does the job for an older version of vbulletin. I've sent the original maker a couple of messages about upgrading it for the latest vbulletin when this thread was originally made, the last I had was a reply that he "intended to update it for 3.8 sometime".

There is currently no mods anywhere that I could find (I did have a bit of a scour) for this version of vbulletin.

So while there is "promise" of a mod coming available to do exactly what the users want, until that time the only two options are things stay as they are, or we do exactly what Martin was posting against (a manual PM by mods to everyone for every tiny little thing even the ridiculous obvious spam that a user would know why it got removed).

Mods already PM about any "less obvious" removals the majority of the time, and those times it does not happen a user can always speak to an online mod if they are confused about a (genuine/honest... not a meaningless spam/flame-fest) post being seemingly removed and they've had no notice and have no idea as to why - that's how things are atm and will stay until an appropriate mod becomes available, but don't think I've not looked for a mod or have not tried poking mod-makers in to sorting something out.

 

[harriergirl]

Thanks for the updates Azz Man