Calm down

[Garrett2]

there are no other points of view. there is only dark angel, or he deletes it.

 

['Tiger']

There was me thinking the forums was a place for people to discuss their views...

 

[Garrett2]

i could give more examAples

 

[Zaheen]

I'm not intentionally trying to take sides, but DarkAngel has a point.

What is with you people, you are so negative and depressing - go get a life or something...

Dimitar, I've told you a thousand times - why must you insist on making yourself seem like a tit. You are a cool chap, so what if people want to post 1000 suggestions? Big deal?

P.S. That Alien route sounded so cool!

 

[flameharvester]

Garrett your such a skilled player with a great knowledge of the game mechanics, the only downside to you is when it comes to things you consider stuoid you dont destroy them with a well reasoned arguement, as a rule. when you have done so the idea has been decimated or redone in a constructive way, please stop saying no and extrapolate!

 

[tobapopalos]

It seems that some people are so used to being negative and cynical about everything to do with the game that they're incapable of accepting that there is even the slightest glimmer of hope and potential for postive changes in the near future, dig yourselves out of your trenches, the dark times are passing, be CONSTRUCTIVE instead of just dismissive, or at the very least, don't be downright negative and cynical, just cos you can't see out of the cloud of negativity doesn't mean you should go pissing on other people's positivity.

You're just as cynical and dismissive as anyone if that is how you interpret this thread. What a ridiculously pointless and ignorant post. I can't believe this came from you, Ogluk. Happy thoughts will not fix the game.

Just because they/we dislike the sheer volume of mundane and/or ridiculous suggestions does not make "some people" cynical, negative, incapable of accepting change, bla bla bla. The comment quoted from IRC was purely about Elderveld's CRA suggestion, which was undeniably retarded, and I don't think ANY of the people in this thread are incapable of accepting change. I have made suggestions, I have many ideas to improve the game, but posting a **** load of suggestions all at once is a good way to ensure none of them receive the proper amount of attention.

I'd just like to see everybody calm down, take a deep breath, and think about the ideas they make. DA hardly helps with his giddy and excitable drivel. Possible new owner? Time to necro a thread about a route which wasn't massively popular to start with! Why not necro every useful and uncontroversial idea which might actually help the game instead? The last thing this game needs right now is more route clutter. As I have said before, fantasy was brought in 25 rounds ago and still has no place. If you think the game has a niche which needs to be filled, change vampires. As it stands that whole branch could be removed entirely and the game would not suffer for it.

Everybody has become so caught up in the idea of change that they don't seem to care about the consequences of change. Should we change round length? Should we add a new route? Should we bring back the CRA? It's like you're ordering a pizza and you can't decide which toppings to choose so you just order everything.

 

[Dimitar]

Bushtarion has always had community-led ideas. Some of our best implementations came from ideas at the heart of the community.

Those 'best implementations' came from people who actually understand the game. People who give it a little bit of thought before posting a suggestion. People going crazy over the supposed sale of the game, and making senseless suggestions are drawing attention away from the actually good suggestions.
Some might call this flakking.

 

[Dark_Angel]

there are no other points of view. there is only dark angel, or he deletes it.

A typically Garrett remark to make. There are clearly a lot of posts in this thread that are at odds with my way of thinking, they haven't been deleted. Yours were for being nothing to do with the subject matter of this thread (referencing AFK randomly has nothing to do with anything).

-

DA hardly helps with his giddy and excitable drivel

Given I have seen strong evidence to support the take over (I'm now in little doubt it is going ahead) I've attempted to get some excitement going about the possibility of new change.

You, Dimitar and Garrett (Or the trio of negativity, as you all might be called) are all quite frankly killjoys. Nobody is forcing you to visit the suggestions sub-forum, if doing so distresses you to the point your head is on the brink of exploding - then do your heart a favour and avoid it.

Really, Toby, do you not think trying to moderate/stifle a bit of innovation is a little mean-spirited? Fine, you think some suggestions haven't been properly thought out. Lighten up and stop being so bloody militant about it?

Those 'best implementations' came from people who actually understand the game. People who give it a little bit of thought before posting a suggestion. People going crazy over the supposed sale of the game, and making senseless suggestions are drawing attention away from the actually good suggestions.
Some might call this flakking.

What is the actual loss to you or the community from what you perceive to be bad suggestions? Your argument appears to be that there's some kind of loss of "suggestion productivity" by people making bad suggestions, but if the people making "bad" suggestions are all "idiots" then surely their time/effort addressing "good" suggestions is also going to be waste?

-

For the umpteenth time - this thread is massively mean-spirited. The bottomline is (as is clear from the responses to this thread) your negativity is far less welcome than the suggestions the 3 of you are so furiously trying to dismiss. (For reasons I can only attribute to the fact that you all like being difficult for the sake of an argument).

 

[Garrett2]

toby has hardly been militant. don't try and lump him in with me in an attempt to summarily dismiss.

it's not my fault or anyone's fault that you don't see the point toby is trying to make. just because you choose to live in a rose coloured, i want to be everyone's friend state of mind doesn't necessarily mean that it's helpful to the situation or to furthering the goals of this game.

tbf, there could be a little less negativity and a little less everything is joy joy. if everything was a little less joy joy, i doubt toby would have even said anything.
and the couple of responses in this thread is hardly a rallying cry for your point of view :/

 

[Dark_Angel]

So we need limits on peoples optimism so toby and a handful of others feel better about their rationing/moderating their own?

The Bush community isn't an equilibrium. People getting excited about the prospect of change (and after 4 years of bugger all by way of changes, can we/they be blamed?)

And I can see Toby's point quite clearly. He thinks people are getting overly excited and as a consequence aren't giving due consideration to their ideas. My retort is that this may well be the case, but anyone with that view shouldn't be aggressively combating this. State in no uncertain terms, by all means, your disagreement, but basically campaigning against innovation (that is, in my eyes, what this thread has turned into) is ridiculous IMO (not to mention pointless).

 

[Dimitar]

For the umpteenth time - this thread is massively mean-spirited. The bottomline is (as is clear from the responses to this thread) your negativity is far less welcome than the suggestions the 3 of you are so furiously trying to dismiss. (For reasons I can only attribute to the fact that you all like being difficult for the sake of an argument).

Yeah, the 5 people responding to this thread are a clear representation of the playerbase and its needs

 

[Garrett2]

the drek that has flooded the forums including rehashing dead threads is hardly innovation.

i've said it before and i'll post it again... bring something new and interesting to the table and i'll be happy to discuss. to date there have been 2 succinct posts with something fresh and worth talking about.

 

[Dark_Angel]

For the umpteenth time - this thread is massively mean-spirited. The bottomline is (as is clear from the responses to this thread) your negativity is far less welcome than the suggestions the 3 of you are so furiously trying to dismiss. (For reasons I can only attribute to the fact that you all like being difficult for the sake of an argument).

Yeah, the 5 people responding to this thread are a clear representation of the playerbase and its needs

What the game needs is a pool of ideas, regardless of their caliber, ready for the consideration of whoever it is who has control over what gets implemented. Some ideas will be better than others, but, again, it is mean spirited for you to launch a campaign against new ideas just because you don't share another person's enthusiasm.

 

[Dimitar]

I say we change the initiative of yobs from 450 to 449. It's a novelty, it must help the game.

PS: This is not a campaign against new ideas, this is a campaign against idiotic ideas, posted by poeple who haven't given their ideas any thought. This is a campaign about people necro-ing threads from years ago, just because they sound cool. Come up with something new and original, think about how exactly it will affect the game, then post it... instead of going "OMG ALIENS"

 

[Dark_Angel]

PS: This is not a campaign against new ideas, this is a campaign against idiotic ideas, posted by poeple who haven't given their ideas any thought. This is a campaign about people necro-ing threads from years ago, just because they sound cool. Come up with something new and original, think about how exactly it will affect the game, then post it... instead of going "OMG ALIENS"

Nope.

The redevelopment of ideas is as important as the creation of new ones. You don't have to go back to the drawing board and erase all progress to date just because something has X number of flaws. Doing so wastes time.

Clearly you disagree with this. Fine. Good, even, say so in response to the thread you're moaning about. That isn't justification for stifling new creativity, though.

 

[Zaheen]

This is a campaign about people necro-ing threads from years ago.

When the original creator didn't pay any attention to any of it?

If they are bad suggestions they they will not be implemented regardless of how many times they are bumped, they are just bumped to see what the current playerbase thinks of them as that surely has changed over the years.

But yet again, it's the *same* tools shooting them down. If you don't like the idea then reply with a constructive response to it, as opposed to childish comments and remarks. Don't take anything I said personal, it's just the vibe I've had for a few years now, and it's a bad one. Probably one of the main causes for a playerbase decline.

I know swearing is bad and all that, but whilst there are the few of us posting suggestions, thinking of possible solutions to problems that have been around for years, what the hell are you guys doing? I know this is the internet and everything, but I really can't understand why people would troll a game into oblivion whilst they continue to play it.

 

[Dimitar]

You're pretty much talking out of context. Noone said suggestions in general are bad. And if you have a closer look, I'm fairly sure there aren't many people who are 'shooting down' suggestions just for the sake of it, without providing any constructive feedback.
Also this thread is not in suggestions, this is in gripes. The whole point of the thread was to say "this is getting annoying, tone it down". I'm not going to offer a solution for a problem that doesn't exist. I'm not saying "stop making suggestions", I'm saying "the sheer amount of poorly thought out suggestions is enough to annoy the hell out of a person".

 

[Dark_Angel]

I'm saying "the sheer amount of poorly thought out suggestions is enough to annoy the hell out of a person".

Then stop visiting the suggestions sub-forum.

Because believe me these suggestions, that you perceive as "poorly thought out", sure as hell aren't going to stop. In fact they're as of yesterday being actively encouraged.

If that is making you "unhappy", "go red", or is otherwise making you feel bad - Then you may wish to stop reading these posts in the first place.

Unfortunately only Azzer can change the description of sub-forums - Else for your sake Dimi I'd change it to:

"Please note: you are entering the suggestions sub-forum - Do so at your own risk. You may find suggestions here that have not been fully considered. Some may be a work in progress, some may need substantial discussion/developing before they are viable for implementation. In extremely rare instances you may find that old suggestions are brought back for further discussion. If you suffer from heart problems, are pregnant or have any health issues you should consult your medical practitioner before clicking this link."

 

[Dimitar]

I'm not allowed to express my feelings about the activity in the forums? I'm kindly asking you to go away. If you don't like this thread you're also free to not read it. You sure as hell can't tell me what to read or comment.
I don't appreciate your post making fun of any potential health issue a user may have, and seeing how you've removed posts because of that in the past, I kindly ask to remove yours as well.
Give yourself an infraction for serious disregard for forum rules/other users as well.

PS: See thread title.

 

[Ogluk]

The scary thing is, I'm agreeing with Zaheen

But anyway, suggestions will come up, always have done always will do, some will be a bit silly, some will be sensible, some will be completely stupid, ALL should be handled the same, with rational discussion regarding the pros/cons of the suggestion, not just throwaway remarks like, It's ****, or that's retarded. Back up your feelings why you feel it isn't best for the game, go into depth as to why that specific thing doesn't fit with how you feel the game should be going etc etc.

Being irrational and just shooting down things you don't agree with without backing up why you don't like them, just creates unnecessary hostility between us, and we really don't need that.

And toby, my post was mainly directed at Garrett who's been acting like a spoilt 12 year old ******** in people's sandwiches for kicks.