Killing The Game

dave

Harvester
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Messages
208
Location
Northants, England
you guys really dont get my point,

one thing is for sure i dont need to learn anything about this game, im an accomploished attacker and player, the fact i wont attack +1 +2 and i aint afraid to loose some troops to have a gd br dont make me a bad player.

i knew this would happen, you try and justify it. i understand why you do it, my point is its killing the game, no1 seems to care they just keep doing it.
 

Yochoko

Head Gardener
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
314
i don't think sending an attack with +2 is a cause of this game dying. i rarely get discouraged by my incs with +1 or +2. i don't see the point of 'rushing' with mods without getting lands, though. :S i mean, the mods (+1, +2, as well as adrenaline rush -1, -2) are the game's mechanics. since they exist, you find the way to counter them. that's 'how to' play this game, i think. if you are allied, you got ally mates to defend you. so, why you'd feel so scared or discouraged? :< if you are solo, then, it absolutely doesn't matter since it's the AR limit that decides what people can send at you. you are just looking at '+2' and not looking at the other factors. also good players or bad players cannot be defined only by the fact that people send with mods or without. i know there are lots of people who are scared of getting even some scratches at the fights. but your accepting to get hurt doesn't make you a good player by default either just for that fact. i think it's more complex to call people or yourselves a 'good' player. complaining about people sending with +2 (because they are out of targets, desperate for easy lands, or simply bored, who knows! but this is a game, so people can play as they please!) which is an authorized act in the game doesn't seem to make you a 'good' player, i'd think. there are solutions to counter your incs. use all the resources. fight a battle that you know for sure you lose and get AR if you are solo and prevent followers, other incs, etc. but if you are allied, i see no excuses, really, and i don't even see a point of this post then. :S
 

dave

Harvester
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Messages
208
Location
Northants, England
stop trying to defend it.....

i know why you all do it, so its easy for you to land without loosing many troops.

trust me ive seen alot of peope quit this game because of it.

my point is simple. it makes people quit.

when u do it seems fine, the people getting hit like that are sick of it.
 

Yochoko

Head Gardener
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
314
well, i don't do it, though. but i *understand* why people do, and i can accept that without whining. that's the difference. it's a shame there weren't people around those who quit because of this to tell them it's something that happens often but not something to get discouraged about, and teach them how to counter/fight/ play properly. ofc, this isn't a game for babies who get only what they want. so, if people are not ready to accept some hard times in the game, i dunno. they may as well leave? but sure, only if they are told or taught about this, though.
 

Dimitar

Landscape Designer
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
2,388
my point is simple. it makes people quit.


Pick one of the following:

1. Quit to prove your point.

2. Provide us with evidence that proves people quit because of this

3. Stop repeating yourself and think about why there are so many people disagreeing with you in this thread.
 

dave

Harvester
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Messages
208
Location
Northants, England
the people disagreeing with me in the thread play at the higher level. i still have no problem with any of you, i u died every night cos people massing you wouldnt wanna play.


how can i prove they leave when they left? i cant get them to back me up there gone.

also your saying quit proving my point because you know its correct, deep down.
im simply using the forums as they should be used, to make a point.
i keep repeating myself because everyones trying to excuse it. if you cant see that killing people over and over and over by massing them with a massive amont of troops, makes them not want to bother and quit, then your quite frankly a moron.

as i keep saying i understand why people do it, lack of targets yada yada.

quite frankie i wish i never bothered making the point. at least sensible players like martin saw what i was saying rather than straight saying im wrong.

have fun ruining the game for alot of the playerbase.
 

Martin

Garden Designer
Super Moderator
Community Operator
Joined
Dec 14, 2007
Messages
970
Location
England
the people disagreeing with me in the thread play at the higher level. i still have no problem with any of you, i u died every night cos people massing you wouldnt wanna play.


how can i prove they leave when they left? i cant get them to back me up there gone.

also your saying quit proving my point because you know its correct, deep down.
im simply using the forums as they should be used, to make a point.
i keep repeating myself because everyones trying to excuse it. if you cant see that killing people over and over and over by massing them with a massive amont of troops, makes them not want to bother and quit, then your quite frankly a moron.

as i keep saying i understand why people do it, lack of targets yada yada.

quite frankie i wish i never bothered making the point. at least sensible players like martin saw what i was saying rather than straight saying im wrong.

have fun ruining the game for alot of the playerbase.

Thanks for the compliment, however I do believe you are wrong.
I see the frustration in being attacked by someone bigger, however when I play CoD I rarely come anywhere but bottom of the pile. This is because I have slower reflexes, worse guns and I don't know the levels... if you are not good at something, better people will beat you.

What I ask is that you view it from the larger player's perspective, in this case Alci. Based on what you have said about scores I guess your score is similar to mine... however for less land (I assume) it would cost anyone a hell of a lot more than 166mil flak to land on me... this is why I don't get attacked, people like you are nicer targets!

Look at yourself how bigger players see you and you will then learn how to do better and get attacked less. Like all games, practice makes you better. ;)
 

dave

Harvester
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Messages
208
Location
Northants, England
well martin you put together the best response. most other players just want to tell me im stupid, from what i can read.

i know that to win the game and finish high you have to do that...that reali isnt my point.

my point is that people leave because of it :/

maybe its a pointless arguement cos it will still happen. but i love this game and i see it die a little more every round. and i know for general fact that lots of players leave because of it. i cant prove this, as ive already stated, because theyve left.....they wont post on here...they no longer use any bushtarion related website.

also i play the way i do, get good land and get land fat because i love attacking, i love a good br, and good kills and a good land steal. i spend all round doing it normally, and i expect to loose the land quickly.

ive never been great at making points, and i feel astho im doing a bad job of it here.

but i know im right in what im trying to say.

more and more people will quit because of it every round, and if u wish i win the round, or be guarenteed a high rank, then by all means continue bashing, you will no doubt finish high.

but when everybody lower than u gets sick of it, there will be go game to play.
 

Martin

Garden Designer
Super Moderator
Community Operator
Joined
Dec 14, 2007
Messages
970
Location
England
well martin you put together the best response. most other players just want to tell me im stupid, from what i can read.

i know that to win the game and finish high you have to do that...that reali isnt my point.

my point is that people leave because of it :/

maybe its a pointless arguement cos it will still happen. but i love this game and i see it die a little more every round. and i know for general fact that lots of players leave because of it. i cant prove this, as ive already stated, because theyve left.....they wont post on here...they no longer use any bushtarion related website.

also i play the way i do, get good land and get land fat because i love attacking, i love a good br, and good kills and a good land steal. i spend all round doing it normally, and i expect to loose the land quickly.

ive never been great at making points, and i feel astho im doing a bad job of it here.

but i know im right in what im trying to say.

more and more people will quit because of it every round, and if u wish i win the round, or be guarenteed a high rank, then by all means continue bashing, you will no doubt finish high.

but when everybody lower than u gets sick of it, there will be go game to play.

Your argument is coming accross fine, but all I hear is "people quit due to people attacking at "+1/+2" - however I disagree, unfortunatly as do the majority of people in response to you. Although even if you are right, you can't prove it - so we go around in circles.

I believe the decline in the game is due to a few reasons, now I urge people to read between the lines as I really don't want newer players to read this and see "omg, the game is going downhill", however I don't think your point can be argued without raising it.
The advancements in technology means that the game is very easily accessable due to phones which means people who are active cannot be killed.... it is also due to the fact people want graphics. Text-based games are not popular! People would rather play "bake a cake" or "make a pizza" on Facebook, or whatever other crappy games are on there.
There is also a lack of admin input and changes, stopping the game evolving to keep up with these changes.

If people quit the game due to the "+1/+2 bashing" then they are the kind of people who won't enjoy this game. This game is good due to the social aspect, communicating with real people and thinking of strategies and psycologies between your play and your oponents play (e.g. making yourself a bad target by seeing yourself through your enemies' eyes).
The game cannot really do much else, if someone is bigger than you they should kill you. If you're a good target you will get attacked.
 

Yochoko

Head Gardener
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
314
well martin you put together the best response. most other players just want to tell me im stupid, from what i can read.

i know that to win the game and finish high you have to do that...that reali isnt my point.

my point is that people leave because of it :/

maybe its a pointless arguement cos it will still happen. but i love this game and i see it die a little more every round. and i know for general fact that lots of players leave because of it. i cant prove this, as ive already stated, because theyve left.....they wont post on here...they no longer use any bushtarion related website.

also i play the way i do, get good land and get land fat because i love attacking, i love a good br, and good kills and a good land steal. i spend all round doing it normally, and i expect to loose the land quickly.

ive never been great at making points, and i feel astho im doing a bad job of it here.

but i know im right in what im trying to say.

more and more people will quit because of it every round, and if u wish i win the round, or be guarenteed a high rank, then by all means continue bashing, you will no doubt finish high.

but when everybody lower than u gets sick of it, there will be go game to play.

wellllll, you seem to understand 'why ' this happens and will continue happening. then, why didn't you try to convince those who left to stick around some more? you love this game and you want it to expand and not dwindle. you still enjoy this game. you could explain to those discouraged people that there are still ways to enjoy the game. losing lands and/or dying (losing troops) is a part of the game. you can be totally annihilated by someone around your rank if they got the right route while even with +2, some routes and their set-up (plus the huge land score) can have a hard time killing you AND stealing lands. or they can kill you and land easy too, sure. (i think the latter is what you are complaining about.) but all those happen in this game. making one of them as a cause of people leaving is wrong, imo. those who left didn't have a chance to learn the game and i feel sorry for that. but if you have seen them leaving, maybe you could try to convince them? or when they started complaining about it or getting fed up with those incs. i think we need more encouraging and leading those people into the 'understanding' of the game to make them stay than just watching them leave. besides... attacking with +2 is really not the hardest to make it a reason of quitting.
 

dave

Harvester
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Messages
208
Location
Northants, England
yochoko, you obviously havent played at that level before.

your point is redundant in my mind.
you cant persuade people to stay, becuase the massing still happens....

you say i just watch them leave, people like you carry on doing it despite the fact it makes then leave, think about it for a second, your trying to say it ok becuase you do it.....
 

Yochoko

Head Gardener
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
314
mmmm... and i think you dunno what i have experienced in this game. i have played the level where me and my ally mates got bashed. i got so many repeat attacks and lost lots of lands too. i got 0'd so many times getting caught after hitting sleep mode. buttt none of those discouraged me enough to stop playing. 'coz i liked other stuff more than the defeat. you are not even trying to understand the others' point of view, though. i thought you understood 'why' people attack with +2, but i guess it was my misjudgement after all. 'coz if you did understand, you can come forth to convince those discouraged people (by the only fact of seeing '+2').

oh and thanks for telling about me when you apparently dunno what i do in the game. i don't do attacks with my LETs to +1/+2 anymroe personally (only when i feel the need for lands, i flak a few lower people with mods). and i rarely repeat attack. also, this round, i'm not killing unless i gain h/f. so, there. and i watch people leave only when they act like babies.
 
Last edited:

willymchilybily

Landscape Designer
Joined
Dec 14, 2007
Messages
1,418
Location
uk
i think you need to bare in mind also, most of the people that have attacked +1 or +2 and replied here, do it for legitimate reasons (range/targets). thats not to say some people havent got a clue how to land a solo or play with tactics, which is how a stratergy game ought to be played.

for them its a paint by numbers. rpg beats robo that guy is in a low ranked alliance all his allies are much smaller than him, easy target i dont need to think, i can just send all i have at them. But most of the people who will read your post on the forums are not that sort of player. They have been around long enough to know how to play, and can hit solos instead of just bashing alliances, or at least join in real alliance attacks. and even if they havent most know how to deal with incoming or have played with people who do.

the problem is not the +1 or +2 at an alliance. its the lack of ability/activity/understanding of the alliance they are in. and alas, the people bashing them succeed once and will come back for seconds. Hence why i disbute the claim attacking at that range is what is driving people away. it's, like has been mentioned, the learning curve and capabilty of alliances at those ranks. not the act itself. the lack of being able to deal with it for lower alliances. not the fact it is unfair or impossible to deal with.
 

CFalcon

Official Helper
Joined
Dec 14, 2007
Messages
680
Location
Kent UK
Almost by definition, anyone who is attacking you will beat you. People won't attack you if they won't beat you. This is how the game works.

Does it actually make any difference to you whether the person who is going to destroy you, because they automatically *are* going to destroy you if they've decided to attack you, does it actually make any difference to you whether they're attacking at 30% or 50%? You're getting destroyed either way.

Also, let's say we decided that attacking at 30% is unfair, and we made it impossible to attack below 50%, like it's impossible to attack below 30% now. I guarantee you that within a few weeks we'd have complaints about how attacks at 50% are unfair and killing the game. Or if we pushed the limit up to 70%, you would only see a massive increase in people attacking in groups. And then we could have some fun complaining about group attacks. Whatever you do, people will always find a way to attack so that they will win decisively. Whether the person who is decisively crushing you is attacking at 10%, 30% or 300% is really besides the point.


I agree with you that there is something wrong with the game, and that the current setup does drive newer and less active players away. However, the solution to this problem has nothing, absolutely nothing at all to do with attack ranges.
 

Dimitar

Landscape Designer
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
2,388
If Azzer came online today and changed it so the +1 range was 45%, instead of 35% and the +2 range was 40%, people would still ***** about being hit at +1 or +2. And people quitting the game just because they see a modifier in the hostile mob means they're stupid. I don't have much more to say as I'd probably be repeating myself or someone else
 

Coruba

Head Gardener
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
266
Location
New Zealand
Hello All

I too have to agree with Dave - not so much re the +1 or +2 attacking - its just the bully boy tactics the top players use to win. As a newbie it is just plain disheartening. In saying this though the game actually is in many ways a victim of itself. The games needs a large player base to make life enjoyable and have more targets to hit. That would increase competition at the top alliances as there would be more talented players.

As it stands now we have a small player base - the really top players tend to play in the same alliances and the game round dies in a matter of weeks.

If you are playing solo imo the only real way to get ahead or finish in a top spot is using solid account management by utilising sleep mode - and then you have to be pedantic about it as well.

Cheers

Coruba

Disclaimer: - I have this round stuck to +2 attacking - I don't give a damn re being a bounty target as I believe my use of sleep mode is better then most. The downside to this is you never have much land.
 

LuckySports

Landscape Designer
Joined
Jul 7, 2008
Messages
1,243
Location
Nonya
I'm sorry dave, but my patience with you is thinning. Read this and listen to what I say.

First off - almost everyone that has responded here has played at EVERY level of the game, inactive low, active high, active low, ect.. We know what its like to be bashed, we know what its like to bash, and something less common, several of us have played honorably, where we always attacked at 60% or higher.

You are accusing us of not understanding where you are coming from, but it is you that don't understand our experience. We've played for a long time, I've seen this game grow over the years, and then turn around and lose popularity, and people attacking at their minimum has been here since the beginning. I think Martin has it closest as to why the game has died off so much.

You keep saying you know the game, but then you say silly things. You might understand enough of the game mechanics to do well enough, but you still have a lot to learn about the play. I suggest you take the advice I gave early - Get with someone that has played solo a lot and ask them to help you with ratios.

Coruba - Most people don't WANT to attack +2 :p I personally only do it when I have no other targets. I usually stay honorable when I don't get involved in alliance wars (impossible to stay honorable for long when you have to hit the same target with 2-3 other people repeatedly. Even during flak-wars :p)
 

Max

Garden Designer
Joined
Dec 14, 2007
Messages
1,015
Location
London
I agree that this is a serious issue with small inactive alliances, as when someone 300% of you sends full force, it basically doesn't matter what route you are. You're dead.

Therefore, my best advice is that if you want to enjoy a higher rank without getting UBER bashed, play solo :)

If you enjoy the chatting on politics pages, then IRC is a great way to socialise with others in your group! Otherwise, I'm afraid as a consequence you'll have to put up with bashers from 300% of your score.

Other tactics do exist for survival - for example sending to the HQ when you go offline. Or sleep mode (although this only works for the most active of members).

Ultimately, if you increase the attack limit, people will still find ways to kill you, this isn't the problem.

I hope that you aren't too disheartened, but remember that for every time they get a good bash on you they lose a TONNE of honour, and become ripe for players looking to bounty hunt. Like me. :D
 

dave

Harvester
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Messages
208
Location
Northants, England
thankyou some people who agree with me!

i have nothing more to say because ive repeated myself several times, and people still try and say they have to play like that. and that im wrong. yahdahyahdah
 
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