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Old 07-07-2015, 10:41 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by No-Dachi
However, we should distinguish between the principal and the current events, as this round was lost on Monday due to superior attacks vs inferior defence.
It was due to you guys having a much higher number of available players at 9am (server) Monday morning. I dunno if you'd call that "superior", which is the point I was making regarding contactability in my previous post.

We had 4 maybe 5 people refreshing at the same time you guys covered (I think) 14+ IDs. On a Monday morning - when most people are either in or travelling to work. I can't argue with those kind of numbers but again I question whether this means XXX were "out-classed".

Looking at the numbers yesterday morning and again, spying/cheating aside for the moment, yeah, it appears you guys wanted it more and could get far more of your guys online than we could.

To my mind strategy/skill/experience played almost no part in the events of Monday AM. I gave up when we were still on fairly even land but when I saw that:

A) We had a spy leaking info and

B) Contactability/activity was not a fight we were going to win when, as one of your members has already mentioned, you guys were/are in the "fortunate" position of being able to get 19 people online "in the blink of an eye". We have a lot of experienced players, myself among them - but contactability for stuff like this is not something most of us can indulge in any more
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Old 07-07-2015, 10:51 AM   #32
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Just as an aside to the spy/cheating allegations, I find it interesting that you identify "class" as the ability to get 19 people online "in the blink of an eye".

Winning on contact-ability is not a feat I'd be shouting about - I haven't been contactable for XXX a single night this round, nor TAOO the round before. Mass contactability in a game where so few people play FTW anymore is quite frankly pointless.

Andddd back to the spying allegations - I'm not going to say much other than rank 1 are obviously going to deny and downplay allegations of their spy in XXX because it massively cheapens their win. Cba arguing the toss over this - it's clear in my mind we'd have had a much better fight out of XXX and BoS if this spy nonsense didn't bring a very sad end to what could have been the best round for a good while.
I was away from Thursday to Sunday, only logging in a handful of times, and obviously not contactable as you guys killed me.

When I left we had a slight score lead, and an acre deficit. When I started planning attacks Monday morning we had a slight score lead, and an acre deficit. Three waves later, we had a major score and acre lead. Bear in mind we had a tech advantage (CW), we had more members attacking than you could muster defending (a timing advantage, perhaps), and we had good planners with access to spies (which answers somsone's rethorical question about why we suddenly recalls attacks that were obviously defended).

We conducted a rather standard recall process; recall all fakes unless the target is undefended and unable to kill the flak. Stay on all reals unless the defence is overwhelming. In this particular case we wanted a fight, and I don't think we recalled a single real on Monday morning.

This doesn't mean that our members are individually better than yours, nor does it mean that our group would beat your group ten times out of ten. It simply means that in this case, we utilized the window of opportunity given to us by a tech advantage, and luckily it was also a time where you were weak in terms of members online.

If everything was equal up until this point (meaning both sides had successful and unsuccessful runs at each other), and we got no (and indeed needed no) information during our major attacks, then I fail to see how this could have any other outcome. I agree with the principal of the discussion, that spying is a low tactic that should be punished. I've always had this attitude, from the very beginning of my time here. I still remember catching Necr0 spying on ViruS in r9/10/11, and I never played with him again, although the majority of the playerbase back then condoned such activities. However, we should distinguish between the principal and the current events, as this round was lost on Monday due to superior attacks vs inferior defence. And no amount of information can make up for that particular tech and members disadvantage.

This is probably falling on dead ground, but I hope that the more sensible of you will get what I'm talking about once the emotions cool down a bit.
Very well said Dachi
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Old 07-07-2015, 11:36 AM   #33
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However, we should distinguish between the principal and the current events, as this round was lost on Monday due to superior attacks vs inferior defence.
It was due to you guys having a much higher number of available players at 9am (server) Monday morning. I dunno if you'd call that "superior", which is the point I was making regarding contactability in my previous post.

With the fear of venturing into semantics: if the attacks succeed they are by definition superior to the defence. Which makes the defence inferior to the attacks. The only way to judge is by the outcome of the battle. If the defender wins, his defence was superior, and vice versa. Again, this is based on a host of variables, such as individual skill, planners skill, members available, time to plan, and units available, and is thus not a dig at any member, planner or alliance.
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Old 07-07-2015, 12:09 PM   #34
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Again, this is based on a host of variables, such as individual skill, planners skill, members available, time to plan, and units available, and is thus not a dig at any member, planner or alliance.
None of this mattered a jot yesterday though - we had about 5 people online at 9am on a Monday morning. We lost this, spying/cheating allegations aside, on contactability. I'm sorry but I don't think BoS did anything particularly special other than the man-power. That's just my assessment of events ofc

That's an element of the win most rounds, obviously (and regrettably), but "who can get the most people online" was a particularly big decider this round, rather than any element of skill or "class". That's not to say it wasn't there in BoS, Dachi, that hadn't been tested.
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Old 07-07-2015, 12:20 PM   #35
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Again, this is based on a host of variables, such as individual skill, planners skill, members available, time to plan, and units available, and is thus not a dig at any member, planner or alliance.
None of this mattered a jot yesterday though - we had about 5 people online at 9am on a Monday morning. We lost this, spying/cheating allegations aside, on contactability. I'm sorry but I don't think BoS did anything particularly special other than the man-power. That's just my assessment of events ofc
If we agree on that individual skill and the planners skill is equal,the attacker will have an advantage in terms of time to plan, as the defenders are reacting. The amount of members available played a huge part, but even if you had more members online, you're disregarding the tech advantage. We had 7.5m CWs that you had no answer to.

However, with more members online the fight would've drawn out, with more fun for both sides, and more potential for ****-ups
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Old 07-07-2015, 04:41 PM   #36
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Is anyone able to tell me the source in which TLA found out about the Attack?
As Sith has pleaded his innocence and said he told TLA
Recon (somehow) has a screen shot from the alliance. Which is convinent don't you all think? BUT as I said to Gazzy to find out who it was...

But as I've said and seen. It doesn't help when you are getting boosted from rank 3 allisnce members with mass PB
You may or got CW before us which would of more than likely won the round (happy to admit that) but when people an alliance has 23-25 IDs from 2 alliances from round start. It's hard to keep people motivated to log in. And doesn't help when our Attack gets sent to rank 3 and "someone" manages to take a screen grab of it. Straight from his phone.

Dachi/Gazzy both great players. Yet you have lost respect experienced/life long players of the game in our alliance. You have decided to go down the route of well known cheaters and support them. Congrats on the win. You may of been able to do it fairly... But we will never know
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Old 07-07-2015, 05:43 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Leeroy View Post
Is anyone able to tell me the source in which TLA found out about the Attack?
As Sith has pleaded his innocence and said he told TLA
Recon (somehow) has a screen shot from the alliance. Which is convinent don't you all think? BUT as I said to Gazzy to find out who it was...

But as I've said and seen. It doesn't help when you are getting boosted from rank 3 allisnce members with mass PB
You may or got CW before us which would of more than likely won the round (happy to admit that) but when people an alliance has 23-25 IDs from 2 alliances from round start. It's hard to keep people motivated to log in. And doesn't help when our Attack gets sent to rank 3 and "someone" manages to take a screen grab of it. Straight from his phone.

Dachi/Gazzy both great players. Yet you have lost respect experienced/life long players of the game in our alliance. You have decided to go down the route of well known cheaters and support them. Congrats on the win. You may of been able to do it fairly... But we will never know
You still seem butt-hurt
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Old 07-07-2015, 06:01 PM   #38
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Hollow victory and round over in a week,have fun with no targets the entire round..

Please for the love of bushtarion split the ally into two

Ps.HAI TIGER!No I'm solo
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Old 07-07-2015, 06:04 PM   #39
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Is anyone able to tell me the source in which TLA found out about the Attack?
As Sith has pleaded his innocence and said he told TLA
Recon (somehow) has a screen shot from the alliance. Which is convinent don't you all think? BUT as I said to Gazzy to find out who it was...

But as I've said and seen. It doesn't help when you are getting boosted from rank 3 allisnce members with mass PB
You may or got CW before us which would of more than likely won the round (happy to admit that) but when people an alliance has 23-25 IDs from 2 alliances from round start. It's hard to keep people motivated to log in. And doesn't help when our Attack gets sent to rank 3 and "someone" manages to take a screen grab of it. Straight from his phone.

Dachi/Gazzy both great players. Yet you have lost respect experienced/life long players of the game in our alliance. You have decided to go down the route of well known cheaters and support them. Congrats on the win. You may of been able to do it fairly... But we will never know
You still seem butt-hurt
Asking for information that is being covered up
Also I think you need a new saying beautiful... Get a "Tad" old ***9786;***65039;
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Old 07-07-2015, 06:26 PM   #40
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----
You still seem butt-hurt
Asking for information that is being covered up
Also I think you need a new saying beautiful... Get a "Tad" old ***9786;***65039;
Common thing to do when there are no valid arguments left, is repeating yourself like a kid whit total non-sens.

I bet the kid was jumping round the corner when he thought he won the round.

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Dachi/Gazzy both great players. Yet you have lost respect experienced/life long players of the game in our alliance. You have decided to go down the route of well known cheaters and support them. Congrats on the win. You may of been able to do it fairly... But we will never know
^ this.
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Old 07-07-2015, 07:15 PM   #41
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The activity vs. "better" alliance argument is an interesting one.

A key point that has been missed so far, is to recognise that both activity and contactability are variable over time and in different circumstances. Quite simply, how far are your players willing to go for you, and for the team?

So being unable to get people online when needed shows a failing on xxx leadership / team spirit.

You also stated that you had more experience and knowledge, compared to our advantage of activity and contactability. If we successfully leveraged our advantage to overcome yours, then we outplayed you. Arguing that our advantage is somehow worth less doesn't make sense to me.
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Old 07-07-2015, 07:18 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by Elderveld View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leeroy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by yan0 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leeroy View Post
----
You still seem butt-hurt
Asking for information that is being covered up
Also I think you need a new saying beautiful... Get a "Tad" old ***9786;***65039;
Common thing to do when there are no valid arguments left, is repeating yourself like a kid whit total non-sens.

I bet the kid was jumping round the corner when he thought he won the round.

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Originally Posted by Leeroy View Post

Dachi/Gazzy both great players. Yet you have lost respect experienced/life long players of the game in our alliance. You have decided to go down the route of well known cheaters and support them. Congrats on the win. You may of been able to do it fairly... But we will never know
^ this.
Definitely jumped around my bedroom and told my parents about how happy I am to have won a round of bushtarion.

Not like it's the first one...
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Old 07-07-2015, 07:22 PM   #43
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Ps.HAI TIGER!No I'm solo
Thank God. I thought you got sucked into playing with known cheaters, and using information gathered by their multis.

Stay solo buddy, much simpler!
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Old 07-07-2015, 07:24 PM   #44
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The activity vs. "better" alliance argument is an interesting one.

A key point that has been missed so far, is to recognise that both activity and contactability are variable over time and in different circumstances. Quite simply, how far are your players willing to go for you, and for the team?

So being unable to get people online when needed shows a failing on xxx leadership / team spirit.

You also stated that you had more experience and knowledge, compared to our advantage of activity and contactability. If we successfully leveraged our advantage to overcome yours, then we outplayed you. Arguing that our advantage is somehow worth less doesn't make sense to me.
Getting people online shows a lack of leadership team spirit? Hahaha
Gazzy... When you quit for a few round... What actually happened to you? Because this is laughable.
Maybe it's the fact people play this game for fun and choose to be UC? Not wake up at 4:30am on a Monday to win a game unfairly.
All you see is a win is a win.
You should question yourself as leader when bush helpers and life long players come to you to discuss foul play. Recon and co really do have you by puppet strings
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Old 07-07-2015, 07:30 PM   #45
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Choosing to be UC as fine, but you can't then claim others didn't deserve the win for not making the same decision. I agree that waking up at 4:30 to win the game unfairly is moronic, but as we won it fairly, I don't understand the point that you're making?
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